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01/07/2009, 9:03 PM I.S. Joined on 09/05/2005 Naaarwich Posts 1,317 Re: Southampton on the brink! On the other hand, Delia has actually invested a large percentage of her own wealth into the club, whereas Cullum has done nothing more than cause a lot of unrest and get a lot of free publicity. No doubt DS/MWJ could have done far better, but don't suggest they had the idea of making money in mind, because I'm sure they're not that mad. If your perception is to doubt one but not the other, then I suggest there's probably more to your opinion than what is best for the club. A personal distate for the majority shareholders perhaps?    Report

01/07/2009, 9:04 PM Metatron Joined on 09/03/2009 Posts 364 Re: Southampton on the brink! "Would I be prepared to accept such a contact when I knew the set up of my company was not geared to giving them the products at a very good price in the first place?" You told us a while back that you contacted the Club and tried to get the print contract - why would you not accept it if they had said yes? Your price/markup is irrelevant - the point is if they owed you money at the end of each month you wouldn't be so keen for them to go into administration - you'd never see that money, and wouldn't be able to pay your suppliers so you would be out of business yourself, possibly bankrupt and facing difficulty starting a new business. That's the reality of administration - local companies/suppliers get shafted because they don't get paid. My point is that it's very easy to talk these things up if it's not YOUR money on the line. Let's agree to respect each others views, no matter how wrong yours may be.    Report

01/07/2009, 9:13 PM bloodwagon Joined on 08/01/2005 Tennessee, USA Posts 669 Re: Southampton on the brink!  Metatron wrote: "Would I be prepared to accept such a contact when I knew the set up of my company was not geared to giving them the products at a very good price in the first place?" You told us a while back that you contacted the Club and tried to get the print contract - why would you not accept it if they had said yes? Your price/markup is irrelevant - the point is if they owed you money at the end of each month you wouldn't be so keen for them to go into administration - you'd never see that money, and wouldn't be able to pay your suppliers so you would be out of business yourself, possibly bankrupt and facing difficulty starting a new business. That's the reality of administration - local companies/suppliers get shafted because they don't get paid. My point is that it's very easy to talk these things up if it's not YOUR money on the line. My point, if it was "Smudgers" money, he would want us to fight, till he got his money rather than go bust Norwich City for LIFE !!!!    Report

01/07/2009, 9:22 PM Smudger Joined on 02/10/2006 Posts 7,902 Re: Southampton on the brink!  I.S. wrote: On the other hand, Delia has actually invested a large percentage of her own wealth into the club, whereas Cullum has done nothing more than cause a lot of unrest and get a lot of free publicity. No doubt DS/MWJ could have done far better, but don't suggest they had the idea of making money in mind, because I'm sure they're not that mad. If your perception is to doubt one but not the other, then I suggest there's probably more to your opinion than what is best for the club. A personal distate for the majority shareholders perhaps? A personal distatse for them failing Norwich City fans and the City of Norwich for far too many years than they should of been allowed to get away with perhaps??? "Are you hopeful, or just gullible???" *Russian Literature, Maximo Park (2007) "Smudger now theres a thing , the thing you must all remember is that they are all Norwich City fans and we must love them for that" . arrdee"    Report

01/07/2009, 9:31 PM Smudger Joined on 02/10/2006 Posts 7,902 Re: Southampton on the brink!  bloodwagon wrote:  Metatron wrote: "Would I be prepared to accept such a contact when I knew the set up of my company was not geared to giving them the products at a very good price in the first place?" You told us a while back that you contacted the Club and tried to get the print contract - why would you not accept it if they had said yes? Your price/markup is irrelevant - the point is if they owed you money at the end of each month you wouldn't be so keen for them to go into administration - you'd never see that money, and wouldn't be able to pay your suppliers so you would be out of business yourself, possibly bankrupt and facing difficulty starting a new business. That's the reality of administration - local companies/suppliers get shafted because they don't get paid. My point is that it's very easy to talk these things up if it's not YOUR money on the line. My point, if it was "Smudgers" money, he would want us to fight, till he got his money rather than go bust Maybe so... but it is not my money on the line and I do not particularly care for the local businesses who may fall by the wayside either. I care about NCFC and it is them who are set to fall by the wayside if Delia and Co do not allow somebody else to step in and take the club off their hands. Being a fan of NCFC I would want what is best for the club.  Many of the suppliers they currently have on their books have been making a tidy profit while not delivering a good enough service for years now.  If they have to make cutbacks then rightly so.  The Turners wished to make some of these cutbacks on our clubs behalf 'hence the falling out with Delia' NCFC are not a bleedin charity to keep businesses afloat that are not providing a quality service at a decent price, or at least they shouldn't be. I bet we still have an overpriced glossy program still next season which is produced on a B2 sheetfed press as opposed to a B1 sheetfed press though. Isn't it funny how you can't get answers to the question of if our programmes are printed for free anywhere though??? "Are you hopeful, or just gullible???" *Russian Literature, Maximo Park (2007) "Smudger now theres a thing , the thing you must all remember is that they are all Norwich City fans and we must love them for that" . arrdee"    Report

01/07/2009, 9:37 PM chicken Joined on 18/08/2003 Norwich Posts 2,853 Re: Southampton on the brink!  Smudger wrote:  I.S. wrote: On the other hand, Delia has actually invested a large percentage of her own wealth into the club, whereas Cullum has done nothing more than cause a lot of unrest and get a lot of free publicity. No doubt DS/MWJ could have done far better, but don't suggest they had the idea of making money in mind, because I'm sure they're not that mad. If your perception is to doubt one but not the other, then I suggest there's probably more to your opinion than what is best for the club. A personal distate for the majority shareholders perhaps? A personal distatse for them failing Norwich City fans and the City of Norwich for far too many years than they should of been allowed to get away with perhaps??? How have they failed the City of Norwich? I am born and bred Norwich and although I consider that they have made mistakes that have lead to recent failure at Norwich City FC I fail to see how this has failed the City that I live in. NCFC is part of the City of Norwich and not visa versa. Quite honestly I talk a load of pointless drivel! (According to Smudger).    Report

01/07/2009, 10:00 PM I.S. Joined on 09/05/2005 Naaarwich Posts 1,317 Re: Southampton on the brink!  Smudger wrote: A personal distatse for them failing Norwich City fans and the City of Norwich for far too many years than they should of been allowed to get away with perhaps??? Failure for the last 4 seasons - yes, poor decision, but mostly lack of funds. What's your master plan though Smudger? Force the club into administration, and damn the consequences - we'll be alright, look at all them others? Cullum will ride in to save us all? That's blind faith that even the creationists would be proud of. Simple fact is, that for the next couple of years we are going to be caught between a rock and a hard place.    Report

01/07/2009, 10:00 PM Bobzilla Joined on 06/06/2008 Posts 129 Re: Southampton on the brink! Smudger, with all due respect, you're  muppet and Friday will show you how far off the pace you actually are. Clubs that have gone into administration and come out again have done so to get the debts written off so the owners can buy them back debt free. Southampton is a publicly owned football club, traded on AIM (I believe). The owners cannot and will not buy it out of administration, and thus far, no-one else has said that they will come in either. Come Saturday, Saints will not exist any more as it was known. And re Wimbledon, Wimbledon had been running a skeleton fanbase for years. The move to MK was too much for most of them, and they chose to start their new club rather than retain their allegiance to the Norwegian investors who had come in to asset strip the club. Not the same at all.    Report

01/07/2009, 10:10 PM foggo7 Joined on 16/11/2007 Posts 448 Re: Southampton on the brink!  Smudger wrote:  bloodwagon wrote:  Metatron wrote: "Would I be prepared to accept such a contact when I knew the set up of my company was not geared to giving them the products at a very good price in the first place?" You told us a while back that you contacted the Club and tried to get the print contract - why would you not accept it if they had said yes? Your price/markup is irrelevant - the point is if they owed you money at the end of each month you wouldn't be so keen for them to go into administration - you'd never see that money, and wouldn't be able to pay your suppliers so you would be out of business yourself, possibly bankrupt and facing difficulty starting a new business. That's the reality of administration - local companies/suppliers get shafted because they don't get paid. My point is that it's very easy to talk these things up if it's not YOUR money on the line. My point, if it was "Smudgers" money, he would want us to fight, till he got his money rather than go bust Maybe so... but it is not my money on the line and I do not particularly care for the local businesses who may fall by the wayside either. I care about NCFC and it is them who are set to fall by the wayside if Delia and Co do not allow somebody else to step in and take the club off their hands. Being a fan of NCFC I would want what is best for the club.  Many of the suppliers they currently have on their books have been making a tidy profit while not delivering a good enough service for years now.  If they have to make cutbacks then rightly so.  The Turners wished to make some of these cutbacks on our clubs behalf 'hence the falling out with Delia' NCFC are not a bleedin charity to keep businesses afloat that are not providing a quality service at a decent price, or at least they shouldn't be. I bet we still have an overpriced glossy program still next season which is produced on a B2 sheetfed press as opposed to a B1 sheetfed press though. Isn't it funny how you can't get answers to the question of if our programmes are printed for free anywhere though??? Oh lovely    Report

01/07/2009, 10:16 PM YankeeCanary Joined on 23/12/2003 New Jersey, USA Posts 4,343 Re: Southampton on the brink!  Smudger wrote:  Metatron wrote: Smudger, I asked this on another thread and I'm not sure if you answered it so here it is again... If you had won that print-buying contract from the Club that you bid for...and if they owed you, say, £10,000-£20,000 each month for programmes, flyers, letterheads and the like...would you be prepared to lose that money just to see the back of Delia/MWJ? Would you pay your suppliers, or go bankrupt yourself? Would I be prepared to accept such a contact when I knew the set up of my company was not geared to giving them the products at a very good price in the first place? I would no doubt cling on to things as long as possible (just as Delia is doing) and go in to administration... I believe they call it running a business irresponsibly??? Come on Smudger, you have spent the best part of three years telling others they don't have the moxy to stand up for the "right way" to enable change to take place at the club. Apparently, you have stood up for your opinion when others doubted you ( including me ). However, you fall a little short when confronted on an issue you have used to criticise the club in the past. Metatron asked you a very good and straightforward question. I know you're not lacking in courage so demonstrate it here by giving an equally good and straightforward answer to the question that was asked, without being evasive.    Report

01/07/2009, 11:11 PM Metatron Joined on 09/03/2009 Posts 364 Re: Southampton on the brink! Well the crucial point there is that Smudger cares little for any local business other than his own (and it does not occur to him that efficient and inefficient suppliers to the Club would suffer in equal measure - it's nothing to do with the Club being a 'charity' or a soft touch). If he had won that print contract, he seems to be quite happy that if the Club went into administration, owing him money, he would simply go into administration himself and stiff his own suppliers (read it and weep, local printers, might want to think about what kind of monthly credit limit you're giving him) who would then...swallow the losses, sack some staff (possibly fellow City fans) or go bust themselves, owing money to...paper companies etc etc. Perhaps if he started to think in those sort of terms about administration, he wouldn't be so quick to advocate it as the solution to all ills. Let's agree to respect each others views, no matter how wrong yours may be.    Report

02/07/2009, 1:30 PM PurpleCanary Joined on 12/10/2007 Posts 1,590 Re: Southampton on the brink! Back to the cautionary tale in Hampshire... The fire sale of McGoldrick and Surman has bought the administrator a few days' grace. So now he has in short order to weigh up two groups to see if either bid is remotely well-founded. Of course if he finds they both are then he will have to work out which is better. This being the administrator who took weeks to discover that Pinnacle was not the answer. Luckily the decision of Pinnacle to withdraw has simplified the process. Except that today the "money man" behind Pinnacle is saying its bid might be back on...we are in danger of getting beyond "you couldn't make it up" territory.   http://thecanarypurple.homestead.com/ "This forum's voice of reason" - First Wizard (16.08.10) "Is it a messageboard you would wish your wife or servants to read?"    Report

02/07/2009, 1:47 PM blahblahblah Joined on 11/05/2006 Looking for a bicycle pump. Posts 8,474 Re: Southampton on the brink! Fialkas' statement to the Jewish Chronicle... I was very pleased to learn today that the Football League have made it known that, in the event of a takeover, no further sanctions will be issued to Southampton Football Club. With that in mind, we were advised by Pinnacle today to reconsider our position, and we are now looking at this. In the event of a successful completion, we remain of the opinion that we will have the support of the fans, which of course is crucial. So he was unwilling to buy the club if a further points deduction had been issued.  Not very long term thinking there I'd argue, concern for season 1 only.  I can't see how the administrator could take him seriously at all. On the ball City ! Never Mind...    Report

02/07/2009, 2:03 PM 7rew Joined on 08/03/2006 Manchester Posts 2,069 Re: Southampton on the brink! Two points that I felt should be made: 1) If a club emerges from administration with reduced debts and money to sign players, then the administrator has failed in his job to get the best possible deal for all creditors. 2) The assumption that going into administration would get rid of the current board is also false. There are many examples of clubs emerging from administration with the same ownership, for example (recently) Leeds.  For a club with a large number of director loans it is more likely that this situation will occur. I am utterly convinced BlyBlyBabes is actually a computer trying (and failing) to pass the turing test.    Report

02/07/2009, 5:08 PM USAcanary Joined on 07/03/2004 Posts 1,291 Re: Southampton on the brink!  blahblahblah wrote: Fialkas' statement to the Jewish Chronicle... I was very pleased to learn today that the Football League have made it known that, in the event of a takeover, no further sanctions will be issued to Southampton Football Club. With that in mind, we were advised by Pinnacle today to reconsider our position, and we are now looking at this. In the event of a successful completion, we remain of the opinion that we will have the support of the fans, which of course is crucial. So he was unwilling to buy the club if a further points deduction had been issued.  Not very long term thinking there I'd argue, concern for season 1 only.  I can't see how the administrator could take him seriously at all. Although I am of the opinion that the pinnacle group is nothing but some sick joke with no real money behind them....................I can somewhat understand why that would be a sticking point. If The FL were to add another 20 points (ala Luton) it would be an incredibly tough ask to avoid relegation to LG2, especially when they have just sold most of their best players. Long term this would be an incredible bad hole to dig out of. Long term the plan of any group is probably to consolidate this year with -10 points and then build for promotion next year. If you are on -30 points you would probably need to spend at least 10 million to just have a decent chance of avoiding relegation. Its also a tough ask to get decent players to come if they know you are starting on -30 points.    Report

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